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1

Friday, May 12th 2017, 5:13pm

Reading/Translation Help Needed

Forum Members,

Help is needed in reading and translating the Marriage record for Agnes Tillman and Johann Melchior Stammel. Identifying relevant information including dates, addresses, parents, religious affilliations, etc. would be very helpful. I am including a link to the record as well as an 2 images below.

Thanks, Boyd Robinson

https://www.ancestry.com/interactive/746…00626/300203469
Bfr2u has attached the following files:

2

Friday, May 12th 2017, 5:21pm

This may be a birth record for Konrad Stammel, not sure?

J. Steffen

Moderator

Location: Bielefeld

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3

Friday, May 12th 2017, 5:23pm

Hallo Boyd,
this is not a marriage record but concerns the birth of a child named Konrad to the couple mentioned.
Still interested?
MfG, J. Steffen

4

Friday, May 12th 2017, 9:48pm

Yes, I'm still interested. Any info would be helpful.

Thanks, Boyd

5

Saturday, May 13th 2017, 6:49am

Im Jahre eintausend achthundert neun und sechszig, den drei und zwanzigsten November (23.11.1869) um zehn Uhr des Vormittags, ist vor mir Johann David Ruland, Beigeordneter

Civilstandbeamten der Gemeinde Mainz, Johann Melchior Stammel, Schiffs-Eigenthümer,

zwei und dreißig Jahre (32) alt, zu Herwen, Kanton Arnheim, Provinz Gelderland, Königreich der Niederlande, bürgerlich anseßig und daselbst wohnhaft, zu Mainz sich momentan aufhaltend, erschienen und hat mir erklärt, daß den zwei und zwanzigsten

November achtzehnhunder neun und sechszig (22.11.1869) um neun und einhalb Uhr des abends, in dem vor dem Mühlthor vor Anker gelegenen, mit Nr 1014 bezeichneten Rheinschiffer "Rotterdam", Agnes Tillmann, drei und zwanzig Jahre (23) alt, Ehefrau des genannten

Johann Melchior Stammel, zu Herwen wohnhaft, zu Mainz sich momentan aufhaltend,

mit einem Kinde mämmlichen Geschlechts, welchem der Vorname Konrad

beigelegt worden, niedergekommen sei

Diese Erklärung ist in Gegenwart der Zeugen, Karl Johann Andres, Gastwirth, zwei und vierzig Jahre(42) alt, und Georg Phildius, Kanzleidiener, neun und zwanzig Jahre (29) alt,

beide zu Mainz wohnhaft,

der Deklarant und die Zeugen gegewärtigen Akt, nachdem ihnen derselbe vorgelesen worden ist, mit mir unterzeichnet

6

Saturday, May 13th 2017, 1:25pm

Thanks Criss for reading/interpreting this for me! According to the Google Translation below, it may be a death record for Konrad and that the family was living on a ship in the Port of Rotterdam. Ancestry.com indicates that Konrad was born on 22 Nov 1869 and emigrated to US in 1895. See Ancestry summary of original record below. Can someone confirm that this indeed a birth record. Also, was the family actually living on a ship?

Again, Thanks to Criss for reading and interpreting.

Boyd Robinson

Google Translation: "In the year one thousand eight hundred and sixty-nine, the three and twentieth of November (23.11.1869) at ten o'clock in the morning, is before me Johann David Ruland, deputy

Civil servants of the municipality of Mainz, Johann Melchior Stammel, owner of the ship,

Aged thirty-two, aged thirty-two, aged thirty-two, aged thirty-two, aged thirty-two, aged thirty-two, aged thirty-two,

November 22, 1886, at nine o'clock and six o'clock in the evening, in the port of Rotterdam, Agnes Tillmann, who was anchored at 1014, was twenty-three years old mentioned

Johann Melchior Stammel, residing at Herwen, at the moment at Mainz,

With a child of mute sex, to whom the first name Konrad

Had come to an end

This explanation is in the presence of the witnesses, Karl Johann Andres, Gastwirth, forty-two years old, and Georg Phildius, Chancellidiener, nine and twenty years old,

Both living at Mainz,

The declarant, and the witnesses' present act, after having been read to them, was signed with me"
Bfr2u has attached the following file:

7

Saturday, May 13th 2017, 1:54pm

Hello
it is a birth certificat
not "had come to an end" = niederkommen means "was born"

yes, the family lived on a boat,later they lived in Mannheim

Here you will find more about J.M. Stammel and his family
http://search.ancestry.de/cgi-bin/sse.dl…div=1&ml_rpos=1

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "Tempelritter" (May 13th 2017, 3:43pm)


8

Saturday, May 13th 2017, 2:30pm

Tempelritter,

Thanks for the confirmation and link. Will check it out.
:danke: Boyd Robinson

9

Saturday, May 13th 2017, 10:32pm

Hi, I just want to add to the google translation. Don't mix the port of Rotterdam in, that is just the name of the ship.

Im Jahre eintausend achthundert neun und sechszig, den drei und zwanzigsten November (23.11.1869) um zehn Uhr des Vormittags, ist vor mir Johann David Ruland, Beigeordneter
In the year 1869, on 23th November at ten o'clock in the mornig came to me, Johann David Ruland, deputy
Civilstandbeamten der Gemeinde Mainz, Johann Melchior Stammel, Schiffs-Eigenthümer,
civil registrar of the municipality Mainz, Johann Melchior Stammel, Ship-Owner
zwei und dreißig Jahre (32) alt, zu Herwen, Kanton Arnheim, Provinz Gelderland, Königreich der Niederlande, bürgerlich anseßig und daselbst wohnhaft, zu Mainz sich momentan aufhaltend, erschienen und hat mir erklärt, daß den zwei und zwanzigsten
thirtytwo years old, resident citizen in Herwen, Kanton Arnheim, Province Gelderland, Dutch Kingdom and living there, being in Mainz at the moment, and he declared to me that on 22th
November achtzehnhunder neun und sechszig (22.11.1869) um neun und einhalb Uhr des abends, in dem vor dem Mühlthor vor Anker gelegenen, mit Nr 1014 bezeichneten Rheinschiffer "Rotterdam", Agnes Tillmann, drei und zwanzig Jahre (23) alt, Ehefrau des genannten
November 1869 at nine and half o'clock in the evening on the rhine-ship nr1014 "Rotterdam" (the name of the ship), which is lying anchored at the Mühlthor, to Agnes Tillmann, 23 years old, wife of the mentioned
Johann Melchior Stammel, zu Herwen wohnhaft, zu Mainz sich momentan aufhaltend,
Johann Melchior Stammel, living in Herwen, being in Mainz at the moment,
mit einem Kinde männlichen Geschlechts, welchem der Vorname Konrad
a male child was born, whom the first name Konrad
beigelegt worden, niedergekommen sei
was given.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "M.I.F.E." (May 13th 2017, 10:35pm)


10

Thursday, May 18th 2017, 5:43pm

M.I.F.E., Thanks ever so much for the updated translation. It adds much to the information about the family. :danke: :danke: :danke: :) :) :)