Lower Silesia, Gulau 1899-1939. Tell me where to look for information.

  • Good evening friends.

    I want to ask you for advice, possibly help.


    My family and I are looking for any information about my great-great-grandmother Anna Ludwig. She is German by nationality. From the stories of relatives from the Republic of Belarus, I know that Anna Ludwig was born in Germany in 1899. There she married Joseph Drozdovsky, a prisoner of the First World War. They had four children whose real names are unknown to me and my family, but we managed to see some of them. They were still alive. When trying to question the children of Anna then ... nothing sensible came out. They were silent. They were very afraid that the Soviet government (they lived in the Republic of Belarus) would find out about their origin and that they would be persecuted after the Second World War.

    Therefore, we have no information about why they fled from German territory through the war with the Soviet Union. Presumably in 1939, but this is not accurate. I was able to obtain scarce data from the marriage certificate of Anna Ludwig and Joseph Drozdovsky, concluded in 1922, although the certificate itself indicates 1924.

    The marriage certificate says that Anna Ludwig and Joseph Drozdovsky entered into a marriage in Gulau, Schweidnitz County. And they lived there. The wedding was attended by her father Joseph Ludwig and coachman Alois Schmidt.


    Why am I writing all this?

    My family and I want to know where Anna Ludwig's parents lived and where they were buried (there is not a word about them in the address books), how many children were actually born to Anna and Joseph in Germany and what their names were. Why and when they decided to flee from Germany to the territory of the Republic of Belarus. During her lifetime, Anna mentioned once that she often went to the Catholic Church and misses it very much. That her whole family in Germany went to church. But at the same time in what - she never said. She also said that she had two brothers. She did not name them. One died in 1942, served in Lutwaff. There was also a sister - Eve. But Eve was a stepbrother, Anna's father married another woman and she appeared.

    There is a photo of Eve. But the photo is very strange. Since my relatives from Belarus were very sick of this topic, they did everything to destroy knowledge about our German roots. There is Eva in a wedding dress, according to legend - with a German officer. The officer is kindly carved and burned. I will attach this photo.
    Friends, I want to say so much about this. But I absolutely do not have reliable information and knowledge of the German language. Therefore, I will attach a piece of photograph and text from the marriage certificate. And, if there is someone among you who can help me and my family ... It doesn’t matter if it’s just a link to an Internet resource or a book. We will be grateful to you.

    Anna and Joseph are buried in Belarus, near Minsk. I was at their graves. Joseph was buried with honors. He has a good gravestone. And Anna ... She doesn’t even have a cross. Ordinary catholic cross. No name on the grave, no data nicknames. She didn't even have a passport. Nothing. Her grave is far from the rest. Like a suicide or a criminal. Just because she is German. You know, we just want to eliminate this misunderstanding and injustice.

    Thank you for reading to the end ...)


    Heiratsurkunde

    Nr. 5

    Guhlau am einundzwanzigsten

    Juni tausend neunhundert zwanzig und zwei

    Vor dem unterzeichneten Standesamt erschienen heute zum Zweck der Eheschließung:

    1. der landwirtschaftlich Arbeiter Josef Drosdowski

    ledigen Standes

    der Persönlichkeit nach bekannt,

    g.k. Religion, geboren an siebzehnten

    November des Jahres tausend acht hundert

    achtzig und acht zu Jastrow Kurgan

    Bezirk Minsk (Russland), wohnhaft in Guhlau

    Kreis Schweidnitz seit 1916

    Sohn des ­­­­­­Stellsmachers Simon Drosdowski

    Und seine Ehefrau Katarina geborene

    wohnhaft

    in Jastrow Kurgan Bezirk Minsk in Russland;

    2. die ledige Arbeiterin Anna Ludwig

    der Persönlichkeit nach bekannt,

    k. Religion, geboren am neunzehnten

    Mai des Jahres tausend acht hundert

    neunzig und neun zu Stephanshain

    Kreis Schweidnitz

    Tochter des Ackerkutschers Josef Ludwig

    Und seine In Guhlau verstorbenen

    Ehefrau Anna geborene Katther

    wohnhaft

    in Guhlau Kreis Schweidnitz

    Als Zeugen waren zugezogen und erschienen:

    3.der Kutscher Alois Schmidt

    der Persönlichkeit nach bekannt,

    34 Jahre alt, wohnhaft in Guhlau Kreis Schweidnitz

    4. der Ackerkutscher Josef Ludwig

    der Persönlichkeit nach bekannt,

    48 Jahre alt, wohnhaft in Guhlau Kreis Schweidnitz

    Der Standesbeamte richtete an die Verlobten einzeln und nacheinander

    die Frage:

    ob sie die Ehe miteinander eingehen wollen.

    Die Verlobten bejahten diese Frage und der Standesbeamte sprach

    hierauf aus,

    daß sie kraft des Bürgerlichen Gesetzbuchs nunmehr rechtmäßig ver-

    bundene Eheleute seien.

    Vorgelesen, genehmigt und unterschrieben.

    Josef Drosdowski

    Anna Drosdowski geborene Ludwig

    Alois Schmidt – Josef Ludwig

    Der Standesbeamte.

    (Signatur)

    Das vorstehender Auszug mit dem Heirats - Hauptregister des Standesamtes zu

    Frauenhain Guhlau Kreis Schweidnitz, gleichlautend ist, wird hiermit bestätigt.

    Guhlau am 27. September 1924.

    Der Standesbeamte.

    (Signatur)

    (Siegel)






  • Hello NoleVil,


    don't feel confused. Ken78 is right.

    In 1932 October,1 happened a change:

    The town of Zobten (Polish: Zobotka) and the rural municipalities of Altenburg, Bankwitz, Groß Mohnau, Groß Silsterwitz, Kapsdorf, Klein Silsterwitz, Kristelwitz, Marxdorf, Michelsdorf, Mörschelwitz-Rosenthal, Protschkenhain, Queitsch, Rogau-Rosenau, Striegelmühle, Ströbel and Wernersdorf changed from the district of Schweidnitz to the district of Breslau (Polish: Wroclaw).


    Kind regards

    Detlef

  • It became even more incomprehensible. Oh. So, then this Fritz Ludwig was caught in the address book of the settlement that entered Wroclaw. Good. And then what about Gyulau? If I'm not mistaken, as modern maps say, this is the territory of Poland and it is now called Gola Swidnica. How should I look further? Which way?

  • Regarding Gola Swidnitsa. I thought so, because on the map there is just near the birthplace of Anna Ludwig - Stefanshain. If you translate closer to the Polish language - this is the village of Stepanovo. Just it appears in the marriage certificate.

  • So what we have. There was Anna Ludwig - a German by nationality who married Joseph Drozdovsky, possibly by nationality of Belarus, a prisoner of some kind of camp during the First World War. She had two brothers, of whom nothing is known, except that Odi died in 1942 and served in Lutwaff. And sister Eve from her second marriage. About which nothing is known either. They all lived in Gulau, Schweidnitz County. They also got married there, a number of children were born there, whose real names are not known to me. But I know their "Russian" names. It is not known where the marriage took place, where the birth of the children took place, in which cemeteries the parents are buried … Wait a minute ... Drozdovsky ... The end of the surname "sky" may indicate that he could be a Jew ... Unfortunately, his photographs also did not survive, as well as those of Anna. Em. Then it all changes. If he really could be a Jew, then ... Then it is clear why they could have fled from Germany around 1939. Because Belarus, which is part of the USSR, was a protected territory. Nonaggression pact. Was that possible, what do you think?

  • Hi,


    just a short info: In January 1938 Jews of Soviet-Russian nationality were expelled from the German Reich. But I am not convinced that suffix -sky / -ski gives a clue to Jewish heritage. See Polish names at wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_name .

    Civil registration books for Guhlau ( Standesamt Frauenhain ) are said to exist at Polish Urzad stanu cywilnego in

    Zarow:

    Births 1912-1942 Marriages 1914, 1916-1938, 1940-42 Deaths 1912-38


    Regards,


    Thomas

  • Hi


    I think you should search for the birth record (with remarks) of Anna Ludwig, *19.05.1899 in Stephanshain, Kreis Schweidnitz.

    Does anyone here know in which archive this could be found or if this birth record could be available online?


    Then you should also search for the original marriage record, because this could also have some remarks which you don't have.

    Does anyone here know in which archive this could be found or if this marriage record could be available online?


    If the birth records are available online, it will be easy to find some birth records of her siblings too, even if you don't know their names. With the dates and remarks in the birth records you could find the marriage records of the siblings too.


    Unfortunatley I couldn't find information that confirms that Joseph Drozdovsky was a prisonner of war or civil internee in WWI.

    He was born in Jastrow / Kurgan, Bezirk Minsk, so you should ask for more information in the subforum Osteuropa as I mentionned before.


    Regards

    Svenja

  • Thomas and Svenya, I am very grateful to you. Thanks for the information. Yes, Svenya, you are right, it would be clear where to look, so I would not even go here - I would find everything myself. But everything is so confusing. Thomas, I thought so about the end of the surname, because so many people in Russia, Belarus and Ukraine who have such surnames usually refer to some extent to Jews. Also, the children of Anna and Joseph looked like Jews in appearance. I mean, some children were really like Germans with a characteristic appearance, others were black-haired and curly, with large noses and brown eyes. And yet - Joseph in German sounds like "Joseph", but in Belarus his name was Iosif - this is the Jewish sound of the name.

  • And yet, Svenya, where did you get that date? May 18th? Yes, the year I know for sure that 1899. Hmm. Just a moment. There is something to check. In 2019, I was just in the place where Anna lived in Belarus. And I went to the local archive to find out something. I was so reluctant to get an address book. I had almost a scandal. Only then they gave. So here. It was said there that Anna Iosifovna Drozdovskaya was born on July 1, 1899, and died on February 18, 1985. And then where is the truth?

  • Hi


    As I said before you should go ahead step by step with your researches. If you know the names, places and dates of birth of the children of Joseph and Anna, you could apply for their birth records, maybe they mention the religion. The marriage record of Joseph and Anna you mentionned before, mentions the religion of both bride and groom. As I mentionned before you could search for the birth records of Anna and her siblings, which maybe also mention their religion.


    Once you will have found some of this documents we can give you more hints for further researches.


    By the way you were the one who mentionned birth 19.05.1899 in Stephanshain, Kreis Schweidnitz.


    Regards

    Svenja

  • That is, you mean that there are some books in the churches? If then marriage was still registered in the church, as well as the birth of children and the names of the dead, then yes, it is appropriate to search in such church books. In Gulau, where they lived, there is a certain Catholic parish named after St. Martin. But bad luck - this is the territory of Poland. And the Poles are less accommodating and friendly than the Germans. In relation to the Russians, I mean. I found on Facebook the page Gola Swidnitsa - the former Gulau. I wrote there and made an attempt to talk. They are absolutely not in contact with the Russians. Unfortunately. I already had the idea to go there this summer, if the situation in a pandemic allows, and personally go to this church. In Belarus I plan to file an application with the state archive. It may be possible to get at least the passports of Anna and Joseph.


  • Hi


    no I don't mean church books, I mean the records of the civil registry offices which should be in an archive.

    The marriage took place at the Standesamt (civil registry office) Frauenhain, Guhlau, Kreis Schweidnitz.


    An die Helfer, die sich in Schlesien besser auskennen als ich:


    In welchem Archiv befinden sich Geburtsurkunden von 1899 von Stephanshain, Kreis Schweidnitz? Sind diese evtl. sogar online?

    Die Geburtsurkunde wäre wichtig wegen eventueller Randvermerke, dasselbe gilt für die Geburtsurkunden der Geschwister von Anna Ludwig. Mit den Daten und Randvermerken aus der Geburtsurkunde könnte man evtl. auch das Schicksal des Bruders im 2. Weltkrieg klären.


    Die zuoberst erwähnte Abschrift der Heiratsurkunde wurde 1924 erstellt, die Heirat fand jedoch bereits 1922 statt. Was könnte der Grund für diese Abschrift gewesen sein, sind sie vielleicht damals schon weggezogen? Wäre es möglich dass es auf der Original-Heiratsurkunde einen Randvermerk zur erfolgten Abschrift gibt und dort auch der Grund genannt wird?


    Gibt es für Stephanshain und Guhlau/Schweidnitz Einwohnermelderegister oder Volkszählungen oder etwas ähnliches und wo findet man solche Dokumente? Adressbücher von Stadt und Bezirk Schweidnitz wurden ja bereits erwähnt.


    Wie kann man über einen Kriegsgefangenen aus (Weiss)-Russland in Guhlau/Schweidnitz mehr herausfinden? Beim IKRK habe ich ihn nicht gefunden, weder als Kriegsgefangenen noch als Zivilinternierten.


    Vielen Dank für eure Hilfe


    Svenja

  • Hey Svenja , die Geb.-Uk. von 1899 Stephanshain liegt im Archiv Breslau.

    Die oo Uk. 1922 ist in keinem der genannten Standesämter vorhanden.


    Gruss Icke/Bernd


    _______________________________________________________________

    MfG

    Bernd aus Grafhorst

    der Europaweit dauersuchende KINZEL,

    Suche für meine Ofb`s Harpersdorf ,

    Pilgramsdorf und Probsthain Nsl

    sowie Crossen a.d. Oder nach Daten

  • Es ist zwar schon ein Jahr her, aber ich möchte trotzdem die Nutzer mal fragen. Ich schreibe es mal auf deutsch weil es kein Beitrag zu diesen Fall ist. Kann man in den Archiven die Reisepässe finden? Ich dachte diese wurden nur vom Besitzer genutzt und es gäbe keine Kopie?

    Würde mich nämlich selber für meine Suche in Schlesien ( Polen, weil meine Suche ja nach 1922 ist) interessieren.


    Mfg,


    Hans